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I was hoping the apistos would be good enough parents to keep the platys away from the fry. I don't think I should worry too much about the endlers, as they are tiny.

I might ask this question in the chichlid forum & maybe I will have to move the platys, although I was trying to not to mix the gold twin bar & red tux platys.

I would like to try to raise them, although I guess it means I won't be able to use the tank as QT for a while - or else, here goes with another breeding trap.
Thanks for the advice.


Cheers
TW

For my shellie fry (which are quite small) I feed a crushed mix of regular flake, spirulina, and freeze-dried blood worms.

I've also used egg in the past, but only in grow-out tanks since it is very messy. I crush a bit of a hard boiled egg yolk with water and feed with either a baster or medicine dropper, depending on the tank size.

The tank looks great, by the way And I'm quite jealous of your married couple, I'm hoping to see a pair here sometime soon...

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There is water at the bottom of the ocean

Thanks for the advice Theresa (oh, and for the tank compliment too). These eggs explain why the male had started to be a little more aggressive to the other residents. I notice now that the female is nearly always to be seen in the gap under the driftwood, where the eggs are, with the male patrolling the vacinity. Nearly everyone has been moved out of the tank now, but it was funny last night watching the male apisto trying to move on an oto, who ignored him. I find the apisto is all bark & no bite (just chases & that was enough for the other residents to move on). My oto was attached by his sucker to the front glass, the male came towards him. Oto ignores this. Male apisto swims to either side of the vertically attached Oto, each time brushing the Oto's body. Swims underneath the Oto, brushing his tail. Oto ignores all this & finally the male apisto gives up & swims away. Very interesting.

Good luck with yours. Hope they pair up soon.

Cheers
TW

I don't know what happened, but the eggs are gone & there's no fry to be seen. Hope they try again soon.

To give the now non-existent fry a chance to survive, I moved out most of the other fish in the tank. I'm pretty hopeless at that & to catch them I removed all the plants & rocks in the tank. I replanted them, but they aren't looking so good. Before I removed them, they were very lush & green looking. Now they're looking yellowish. I guess it will just take some time for them reestablish themselves.

Cheers
TW

Decided to pull all the plants & rocks out to add some left over ADA Amazonia soil to this tank.

It's all added now. Currently all my fishies (including Mr & Mrs Apisto C) are in a temporary holding tank (no filter, but a heater) and I'm waiting up for the dust to settle, so I can put the fish back in. This time the water is so cloudy, which didn't happen at all when I set up the 23.7G with the same stuff.

I hope it settles soon, so I can put it all back together. Wish I hadn't done it now, it's such a cloudy mess in there.

The reason I did the change was because the ADA soil is meant to mimic the water conditions of the amazon (pH & softness,etc) so I hoped it would make the next spawn more successful (eggs just plain disappeared). Plus, as I've decided to use Eco for the next tank, it was just sitting in the garage going to waste.

Anyway, I think this is going to be a late night. Maybe it means I'll be able to catch Australia & Italy in the soccer, instead of sleeping through it.

Cheers
TW

It should clear up soon. Are you running your filter? Did you add the soil to the tank with water in it?

Also I was uprooting some plants this weekend which clouded up my water pretty good. The tetras and betta didn't seem to care. If it starts to clear up some you may just throw them back in.

Good luck.

Rick
See all my pictures at Google Web Albums

Hi Rick

My filter has been running for about 2hrs now and the water is clearing, but not clear by any means. I think my error was in not fully emptying the tank. I did a 50% water change (my fishes are currently in the water I took out) and left the other 50% in.

That must be the difference. The 23.7G tank had ADA added while completely empty - and it was clear from the get go.

I should have remembered to empty it fully. I'm a little nervous to add the fishies back with it so cloudy, so I hope it's not too much longer. It's already after midnight here.

Cheers
TW

I did a 50% water change (my fishes are currently in the water I took out) and left the other 50% in.

Robyn,

You should have looked at my 20G Log first before you did your work on this tank. As you would have seen, emptying the tank all the way is what you really should do.

I would advise you to do quite a few 50% water changes over the next few days, maybe daily. I don't know for sure, but I can imagine that the goodies in the substrate are not intended to become all water-born when setting up the tank.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Ingo,
I know, I know, I know . I did read your log first, but I guess I wasn't thinking. I didn't add the fish back yet as I'm not happy with the dust in the water. I worry about it getting in their gills when they breathe. I ended up ringing in work for a day's annual leave. It's looking much clearer, but not totally clear. Normally the tank is crystal clear & it's not a look I'm used to. I think I'll put plates down on the substrate and do a 50% water change now. Then, can I might add back the 50% water that the fishies are still swimming around in now, so that they still have some of their original water.

What does anyone think?

Cheers
TW

Just keep doing water changes and it will clear up. As long as the fish aren't showing any signs of distress I wouldn't worry about it. Keeping things more stable for the fish will be the best thing for them.

Also kudos for taking the day off to save your fish. Thats dedication./:'

Rick
See all my pictures at Google Web Albums

I just couldn't bring myself to put the fishies back in the way it was. It really did looked a lot clearer this morning, but take a look at the photo. This is the water I took out of the tank this morning. I'm glad I didn't put my fish in this water.

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Cheers
TW

Yuk,

That is for sure some dirty water

It seems like this ADA soil is really very tiny and stays water-born for a long time.

Let me ask you this question: why would you want to add the water back into the tank? Is it because of the beneficial bacteria? These guys are actually not so much free floaters as they like to settle on things, like glass, filter, sustrate, plants, anything really. So, what would be the point of trying to add dirty water? You could go and wait until most of the dirt is settled and carfully shovel off clearer water from the top, if you wanted to.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

No, no I didn't mean adding that horrid dirty water back you saw in the picture.

Before I added the ADA, I took out 50% of the tank water & put my fish in that water, while I put the ADA in the tank. (I have 2 x 31G containers on wheels that I use at waterchange time - so fishies were in one of these with the 50% tank water) It was that water I was talking about - not the yucky brown pictured water.

The reason I wanted to put it back in was because I heard you shouldn't change more than 50% of the water at any one time.

So my original plan was - 50% original water that remained in tank, then add ADA soil, then 50% fresh water & add the fishies. I got as far as adding the 50% fresh water & then waited for the water to clear.

However, even with the filter running overnight, the water was still not looking good enough for my fishes (as per previous pic). I then removed 100% of the dirty water in the tank.

This meant, that unless I reused the 50% water fishies were then swimming in, that they would be in 100% fresh water. Now I know we do that when we buy new fishies, but it was that I wanted to avoid.

Anyway, they are all back in - but the ones I am worried about the most are the otos. Although I rigged up a heater in their temporary container, I don't think they were happy being in a white container. They paled so much, they almost looked white or yellow themselves. I almost didn't recognise them as otos. They seem ok now, so I hope they recover.

Here is a shot, which I hope shows that the water is now clear. It made a big difference doing it properly with an empty tank.

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Cheers
TW

You live and you learn, Robyn

Not only does the shot show clear water, it also shows off your Apsito

Glad the Otos are back to normal. I have to say that I have never seen them change color, even under stress. How strange!

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

another try at photographing my fish.

still blurry, blah blah blah

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Cheers
TW

Well Robyn,

Blurry or not, yours seems to have more red on the anal fin than mine does. Also, mine doesn't have no lack speckles on that fin. Now, given that my male isn't all that larger than the female, maybe he is still young and will get more red in the fin when he is grown up.

And don't be frustrated about the picture quality, is showed me what I needed to see

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I've tried to get some good shots of the female cacateudies, but can't manage it. Following are several shots, which after you've looked at each, you might get an idea of how she looks.

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Cheers
TW

another

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Cheers
TW

another

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Cheers
TW

Your's seems very yellow in the body, similar to my viejita. My caca is by far not yellow in the body what-so-ever, at least not yet. What I observed today (and last night) is that the male spends most of the day in hiding. Occasionally the female comes close and he moves slowly forward towards her, but then she leaves and he goes back in his cave (actually a spot below the horizontal heater in the back of the tank behind the big rock - see the 20G log for pictures of the tank).

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

I didn't see the eggs, nor the wigglers, but I see now about 20 or 30 free swimming fry from my Cacateudies. Mum is proudly guarding.

I hope this first time mum can do a good job.

Edit: I've made her job easier & now the only occupants are the parents, fry & 2 otos. Otos are vegetarians, right? So fry should be fairly safe?

Cheers
TW

congrats on the babies, robyn! isn't it lovely when your pets are happy enough to breed?

as you're aware, parenthood is an art and your female may lose most if not all this batch. (my female is guarding a second batch of eggs at the mo, after having lost all her first brood). but hopefully this is just the start of a long and productive breeding cycle!

enjoy.

justin

Thanks Justin

Did yours lose them to predators, or just died off one by one, until none left?

Cheers
TW

mine are by themselves in their tank, so no predation - tho i have had boys eat their own offspring before, so that's entirely possible. but she has new wrigglers this morning, so here's hoping. (i don't have anywhere to put babies anyway, but hey!)

justin

Same here, Justin, no spare tank for babies, so I guess if I'm ever successful in one or two growing up, eventually I'll have to give them away

But, for as long as the parents will tolerate them in the tank, I'd keep an extra pair (or two)

Cheers
TW

Picked up a male Pelvicachromis Nigeria Red, who is currently doing his QT in this tank. Eventually, he will move into the community tank. They did not have any females, but this is one instance when I only wanted the male. As a breeding pair, they would have been too mean for the community tank, but a single male is meant to be peaceful, I hope.

Here is a picture of him still in the water bag.

He's now in the tank, but he seems quite agitated for some reason. He's also not as colourful as he was at LFS. I hope he colours up, but I wonder if his colour was so good in LFS as there was another male for him to show off to.

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Cheers
TW

So - just to clarify, this is Pelvicachromis taeniatus "Nigeria Red", right?

What came over you that you bought that fish, and why does he have no wife? Try to find out more about these fish as I think they have less aggression during breeding than Kribs do.

I can imagine that being the sole fish of his kind will have an impact on how colorful he is. There is neither someone to show off not someone to attract.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Yes you are right about his name. What I have discovered is that when breeding, he is every bit as mean as a krib. They didn't have any females, only 2 males. I researched him previously, as he was the first fish I saw a picture of when I began my journey towards the dehane (you remember, the one I didn't end up getting, after waiting months). Firstly I saw a pic of Nigeria Red, then the closely related Mowlie & then finally the dehane (they are all close cousins - this is just the different local). Everything I found tells me that a breeding pair are just plain mean & don't belong in a community tank, but that either a lone female or lone male will do fine.

I probably won't see his colours showing up so well, unless every now & again & let him look at himself in the mirror. You know, I even read somewhere where a person with a lone male stuck a picture of a male on the outside of the tank (facing in) and his male was always displaying to it If I search through my Practical Fishkeeping magazines, I could even try it - as it was an article in that about the Nigeria Red that started my whole journey into wanting to keep dwarf cichlids. If I stuck this picture on the tank wall that is up against room's wall, no-one but the fish would even see it. That wouldn't work in the community tank though.

Besides that, I needed a pretty fish to cheer me up Ingo. My very favourite fish were either dead or dying & I had arranged for my babies (fry) to leave home.

Cheers
TW

I understand Robyn

You could also try to find someone with a good camera and take a picture of him and then later show him that shot. He would have no clue that he is displaying to himself

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

You could also try to find someone with a good camera and take a picture of him

I'm yet to find this person. When my stepdaughter was visiting last (she is currently doing a 1 yr teaching post in the sticks - is that the same slang as USA would have for somewhere way out in the bush- like a small country town - the type with only one restaurant, one petrol station, etc) Anyway, she has undertaken an under water photography course, so I asked her to take pictures.

But still the pictures didn't turn out well.

Anyway, here are a few shots of him, blurry as usual, but I still hope it gives you an idea.

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Cheers
TW

Another

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Cheers
TW

another

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Cheers
TW

This tank just seems to take care of itself. Everything grows so slowly & the wisteria can go months without needing a trim. That's why, I don't often post in this thread, as there is usually nothing to show or write - except for any new arrival.

So, the next pic will be a full shot, as I haven't included one for a while.

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Cheers
TW

I have to say that the most beautiful thing I see in these pictures is your Nana . It just looks really healthy and stunning. Is that only one rhizome in the last picture there or are these multiple of them bunched together?

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Here's the full shot, which I thought I posted last night.

Thanks for the Nana compliment Ingo. Apart from the fact it has never flowered, it is a really nice one, on a really interesting little piece of wood. Just for you, at next water change when I pull it out, I'll take a picture of it out of the water showing the rhizome. As far as I know, it's just the one plant. This one, I bought as is (didn't tie it on myself).

The wood has some openings that create natural caves that my cacs loved & the nigeria red also seems to like. The wood itself causes me some grief. It always grows a white fluffy algae (like a fluffy white beard) that I clean off each week. Nothing on the plant itself though.


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Cheers
TW

Interesting Robyn,

Is there a specific ,besides the white fluffy algae, for you to take out the wood each week? I know of white fluffy stuff on wood within the first month or two after being added to a tank, that is some fungus or something like that and it will go away by itself after a while. But yours, I believe, is in the tank quite a bit longer. Are you sure it is white and not light gray? That would be some form of BBA, I assume.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

LFS told me it had been in his tank for 12 months & I've bought it the same day as the otos (cause he said they would like it - but don't bother with it too much). You are right, I've had it a long time.

I take it out each week, just because it's small enough to do so easily & I can then gravel vac underneath it. (I even take out that big bit of wood in the 43.5G each week, so I can clean underneath it).

It looks white underwater, but when I take the wood out, the fluff becomes hard to see & I think it might be grey (& that's why it's hard to see against the dark wood).

How do I get rid of it, without taking harsh action to hurt the anubia itself. It doesn't have even a slight hint of algae - it's just the wood.

Cheers
TW

How do I get rid of it, without taking harsh action to hurt the anubia itself

Well, if you have flourish excel then you could drip a few drops on the wood while it is out of the tank and let is sit for a minute or two. Try not to have the drippings run on the Anubias, I found that direct exposure to excel has negative long term effects as some of my leaves started to die off when I treated them for hair algae.

Ingo

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Proud Member of the New Jersey Aquatic Gardeners Club

Pic of the anubia still to come tomorrow, but here's another shot of Nigeria Red

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Cheers
TW

Firstly, here is a full shot of the tank after water change. It is the first time in ages there has not been a fry net in this tank. Since I couldn't run my small hospital tank here any longer, I set it up at my son's house & put the babies there instead.

So here's to celebrating water changes without a fry net - it has been a long time.

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Cheers
TW